Honda Prelude Forum banner
Cancel
Create thread New Garage Forums

proper engine break-in procedure

1 reading
Jump to Latest
19K views 53 replies 17 participants last post by  starscream74  
M
#1 ·
so i've been telling people how to properly break in fresh engine builds or rebuilds for years. and occasionally i get people telling me they refuse to listen to me cuz they think its better done a different way, or they say they will simply attempt to do it a different way because they read it somewhere on the internet from an unknown source, such as places like honda-tech members, motorcycle website (motorcycle engines arent even remotely similar in design), private unreliable websites with zero reference to credibility, and many many other sources. so here it is directly from DARTON
i will be adding this to the FAQ sticky as soon as i submit the thread. i couldnt have worded it any better myself, so i am copying and pasting this directly from Darton.
im sick of people not breaking their engines in properly because they just dont know how to listen to the pros.
so here it is directly from Darton, i repeat, directly from DARTON on how to properly break-in a HONDA engine in specific:

well, here it is; some hardcore proof that i have been giving the proper advice all along:

this is taken directly from Darton's website, on how to properly break in a Honda engine:
page 14 in the honda manual found at this link:
http://www.darton-international.com/tech_man.htm

Break-in, tuning​

Fill the engine with a good grade of mineral oil (not synthetic) with viscosity for your bearing clearance and intended use.
Prime the oil system before engine start with ignition off using the engine or dyno starter. We require break-in and tuning using an engine dyno or chassis [for darton sleeved engines, may be done on the street by a professional if the engine is not sleeved with darton sleeves, in a manner that loads the engine similar to what is described here about doing it on the dyno (comment by motox)]​


dyno as follows:
· After initial start up, warm up engine at 2000-2500. Precaution should be exercised to prevent excessively rich or lean conditions, which will gall the cylinders. Monitor oil pressure and temperatures.
· After initial run, adjust valves if using adjustable valve train and retorque heads. Check for leaks.
· Street engines will require multiple run ins with increasing rpm and load up to maximum output.​



Use of a dyno allows one to apply a pre-set load to allow the piston rings, and other components to seat properly. It is also much easier to monitor temperatures and pressures than while driving. Most dynos are equipped with O² and EGT probes to aid in tuning. The timing and fuel curve needs to be tailored to your particular engine to ensure the engine stays out of
detonation, which will lead to engine failure. A racing engine is generally built with sufficient clearance to require no further break-in after dyno tuning and power runs. However, we recommend head bolt torques be re-checked cold after dyno testing as the head gaskets will take a set. Remember to replace oil and filter after the dyno session as bearing
coatings and metal particles will be trapped in the oil filter. Inspect the oil for foreign material and excessive bearing flakes.​



A street engine should be driven moderately for the first thousand miles, as follows:
· full throttle high torque power useage should be limited and never be used until the engine has been running for at least 15 minutes.
· from 0-500 miles (0-800km), do not exceed 4000 rpm.
· from 500-1000 (800-1600km), do not exceed 6000 rpm.
· over 1000 miles (1600km), no restrictions.
Also, do not run at the same speed for extended periods during break-in. Make certain the engine is operating at proper coolant temperature and oil pressure. Do not allow the engine to overheat. Make necessary changes if required (radiator, fan, tuning) to get the engine to run in the proper temperature range. We also recommend you do not run synthetic oil until at least 5000 miles (8000km). Synthetics work so well that the engine will never break in properly if it is used too soon.​


~Steve​
 
M
#4 ·
jlude90 said:
http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm

i'm sure you're referring to this website, but how can you say motorcycle engines and car engines are different?
Click to expand...
most modern motorcycle engines use ball bearings for crank bearings. nothing like what car engines use, not even close. and motorcycles are designed to rev much much higher than car engines.
THE ABOVE LINK YOU POSTED IS THE EXACT INCORRECT INFORMATION that i was referring to. following that link will potentially, and most likely, cause extremely harsh damage to your engine. DO NOT FOLLOW THE INFO IN THAT LINK!!!!!! ESPECIALLY IN A LOW-REVVING NON-VTEC HONDA ENGINE!!! heck, i wouldnt even follow the info in that link for a motorcycle lol. not just because i personally know its a bad bad idea, but also due to the fact that there is no reference to anything credible anywhere on that site. to an experienced engine builder, even that site appears to be a personal opinion of someone that has only a minor clue on how to do it, but not the full concept of everything involved.
 
M
#3 ·
stated seperately, because its not quoted from darton directly, but is quoted in similar wording from many other professional engine builders, as well as stated similarly in the repair manual:

proper ring seating procedure on the street without the use of a dyno:

-follow the beginning stages of what is stated above until you get to the part where the engine is fully warmed up.
-drive the car mildly for at least 15 minutes, never exceeding 4k rpms, and never "lugging" the motor (too low of an rpm)
-in 3rd gear, bring the engine to around 2500-3k rpms, and lay into it full throttle up to 5k rpms. when you reach 5k, DO NOT push the clutch in!! simply immediately but milsly gently let off the gas with the car still in 3rd gear and let the car and engine decelerate on their own back to 2200-3k rpms. cruise for a few moments in this rpm range. repeat this process 2-3 times.
-repeat the above process 2-3 times, but revving it from ~3k-5500 rpms
-repeat the above process yet again 2-3 times but revving it from ~3k-6k rpms.
-throughout the entire processes above, keep a close eye on the coolant temp and make sure it does not overheat. if it does overheat, immediately push the clutch in and COAST to a stop while in neutral, taking your time to slow down as to maintain airflow through the radiator to help the engine cool. once pulled over, immediately shut engine off and let it sit for at least an hour, then take whatever SAFE means necessary to bring the vehicle somewhere where it can be inspected for what caused the overheating. do not drive the vehicle to this location. push it or tow it. driving it can potentially cause more damage than may have already been done.
-after the entire process above has been completed, drive around for ~5-20 minutes keeping the rpms between 2k-3500, being slightly gentle with the gas pedal, trying to keep it below half throttle. go to wherever you have to go to do the next step:
-shut the engine down, and change the oil and oil filter immediately, as quickly as possible after shutting the engine down. doing it as soon as possible after shutting the engine down is for the sole purpose that any foreign particles (mostly piston ring particles) that have mixed into the oil will still be suspended in the oil, and will come out when you drain it. the longer you wait, the more likely the particles will settle into areas of the engine that wont drain fully, meaning the particles wont fully be washed out when you drain the oil.

as stated above by darton, never use synthetic oil during the break-in process.
after these steps have been completed, follow the oil change guide and rpm range guide as stated above by darton.

~Steve
 
#5 ·
That's good info.. Now are some steps takin differently if ur using golden eagle sleeves?!? What sleeves would u use? As far as oil goes, say with my build what kind would I want to use. I've heard 0 w40 and such. U, blake and blue01 are the ones that I look up to the most on here cuz I know u guys have experience from it when it comes to motor work and tuning..
 
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
M
#6 ·
dartons advice applies to any type or brand of sleeve, as well as stock sleeves/cyls.

i only posted the street procedure for seating the rings, because darton highly reccommends dyno usage for it, and wont post street procedure lol, cuz they can be held liable as a full-blown corporate industrial company

oh, and for oil, 5w30 or 10w30. most repair manuals reccommend 5w30, i personally always use 10w30, simply because with a rebuilt engine the bearing clearances are usually slightly larger than the minimum spec. notice how darton says use the proper oil viscosity for the bearing clearances being run? tight clearances, like really tight clearances, should use 5w30. normal, common, typical clearances should use 10w30
 
M
#10 ·
0? are you nuts? i dont know where you heard that, but that is plain and simply wrong.

the newer sohc civics, like 06 and newer, reccommend 0w20 or 0w30 from the factory, but definitely not 80's and 90's hondas by any means. oil with a cold weight of 0 will in itsself do some damage to your engine, and cause very very very increased engine wear.

only way you'd want to use cold weight of 0 is if you dont plan on your engine lasting any more than a total of 80k miles from when its brand new or professionally built or rebuilt, and only if you plan to change the oil like every 1k miles, and only if you're looking for like 5hp max gain from it, usually its more like 1-2hp gain though.
 
#9 ·
sounds like the break in I used...got it from the old one (ENDYN).

I'm pleased with the results...feels like a strong engine...gets good gas mileage.
*shrug*
as far as retorquing the head bolts...I did all the work to take my cams out and retorque the bitch and not a single one was less than 62 lb/ft (ARP studs...so the torque is a bit higher)
stock head bolts may be different.

and adjusting the valves after the initial run...why?
I did mine at 1000 miles and 5000 miles...they were just starting to get a little tight both times.
come to think of it...its about time I do another adj.

if the manufacturer says use 5w-30, I use 5w-30...if they say 5w-20, I use 5w-20.
the insight uses 0w-20, I dont know of any other hondas that do. maybe the civic hybrid, I can't remember.

to my knowledge, you can't get conventional 0w-40, only synthetic.
 
M
#11 ·
tsiah said:
sounds like the break in I used...got it from the old one (ENDYN).

I'm pleased with the results...feels like a strong engine...gets good gas mileage.
*shrug*
as far as retorquing the head bolts...I did all the work to take my cams out and retorque the bitch and not a single one was less than 62 lb/ft (ARP studs...so the torque is a bit higher)
stock head bolts may be different.

and adjusting the valves after the initial run...why?
I did mine at 1000 miles and 5000 miles...they were just starting to get a little tight both times.
come to think of it...its about time I do another adj.
Click to expand...
in a completely rebuilt engine the cams and rockers are assumed to be brand new and not broken in yet. or if you're using different cams, and/or i you're using new rockers, or the old rockers but in different locations than they came from. when this is the case, the valvetrain breaks in fairly quickly and creates excessive valve lash in a short amount of time. not a huge enough amount to cause damage, but definitely a big enough amount to require an adjustment pretty shortly after seating the rings. and again a few hundred miles after that.
 
M
#15 ·
the lower cold weight oil provides oil pressure quicker immediately after startup because its thinner when cold and flows better, and gives better gas mileage and power before the oil temp has warmed up to normal temp, but its also too thin for most typical drivers because of that fact; the oil is thinner than it should be before the oil temp has fully warmed up. and 90% of engine wear is caused from driving before the engine AND oil temps have warmed up fully. it usually takes 10-15 minutes for an engine to fully warm up when cold, at idle, and an additional 10-15 minutes of actual driving for the oil temp to get fully warmed up. now think of that fact, and imagine how much of the average person's driving is done with the oil below full operating temp. now picture the damage/wear that is inflicted. now throw thinner oil into the mix. you get the idea

and yes, thats right, 5w20 is what the newer hondas use. my brother's gf has an o7 civic, and i remember he did an oil change on it and said it needed a special rare oil, forgot if it was 0w20 or 5w20. but yeah, its 5w20, i just checked myself. which is the same cold weight as older hondas' factory reccommendation, but thinner warm weight; fuel economy purpose. but those engines are also designed specifically for that oil to be used in it. ours arent.
so 5w30 it is for tight tight bearing clearances, or 10w30 or 10w40 it is for typical bearing clearances lol.
NON-Synthetic throughout the entire break-in procedure!!!! dont forget that people!! never use synthetic oil until you have at least 5000 miles on the engine!!
 
M
#19 ·
definitely. every chance i get, i always start all of my vehicles ahead of time, as long as possible ahead of time, strictly because of that factor.
maybe thats how my last blazer (93 s-10 blazer 4x4) went 260k miles on the original engine before the oil pressure started to drop a couple psi and the rings started to not seal so great. heck, even when it had 250k miles, it still had a low of 180psi and a high of 182psi in a compression test. and you can definitely assume that 90% of the miles i put on that engine were stop and go town/city driving and off-roading, and 90% of those miles were heavily abused haha.

when my prelude is done, you can count on me never touching the gas pedal at least until the coolant temp guage reads fully warmed up, never
 
#22 ·
motoxxxman said:
if my prelude is ever done, you can count on me never touching the gas pedal at least until the coolant temp guage reads fully warmed up, never
Click to expand...
fixed :hmmm:

98vtec said:
it felt weird buying cheap as oil for my motor. autozone brand....ugh.....with a honda filter :)

cant wait to break mine in, but it wont be on the dyno. I plan on breaking it in on a road that just goes straight for 5 miles out in the middle of no where. One of the most important things about breakin in the engine is to let the engine decelerate itself. Do not push the break. Doing this allows the the rings to seal on another spectrum than just acceleration when the rings are expanding on the bottom of the ring land.
Click to expand...
don't keep the engine at the same RPM for long periods of time.
-advice from the old one
 
#20 ·
Moto, this is a good thread. I am sure a lot of prelude owners will use this, including myself. I was wondering if you would please site your sources. You mentioned Darton a lot, and the webpage that has this procedure. I just think it would be more beneficial for luders to see a link. Post a link in your post to the exact web page you got the info from. I'm just asking. Some people are more likely to follow if you can site this.

I'll be breaking my engine in sometime in the future. Thanks.
 
#21 ·
it felt weird buying cheap as oil for my motor. autozone brand....ugh.....with a honda filter :)

cant wait to break mine in, but it wont be on the dyno. I plan on breaking it in on a road that just goes straight for 5 miles out in the middle of no where. One of the most important things about breakin in the engine is to let the engine decelerate itself. Do not push the break. Doing this allows the the rings to seal on another spectrum than just acceleration when the rings are expanding on the bottom of the ring land.
 
M
#23 ·
lol tyler. oh, it will get done lol. i just need to finish up those other things first before i can get into my car.

and the thing about not keeping the engine stay at the same rpm like youre talking about, sounds like your countering blakes comment about not hitting the brake. but he's ring. like i said above, you need to leave the car in gear, and not push the clutch or brake. just let off the gas and let the engine decelerate on its own from the vacuum, which also slows the car down. aka downshifting but without shifting haha.

and link to the info from darton is in the darton sleeve install manual for honda engines, page 14, which can be found at this link, which i will also add to the first post:
http://www.darton-international.com/tech_man.htm
 
#24 ·
I'm not countering him.
I'm saying you need to operate the engine at various RPM and loads (accel and decel)
He said he plans on driving the car down a 5 mile stretch of road...I'm just saying change gears a few times, speed up and slow down...don't operate the engine at the same speed for long periods of time :D not good for break in.
 
#27 ·
Man, i'd have to drive 20 miles to find an open strech of road.:shock:
Atlanta sucks!

Anyway wanted to pose a question about a complete head rebuild here. Assume the bottom end is untouched, but i completely rebuild/hot tank/shave my head. Are there any certain procedures i need to follow to break the valve train in?
 
#31 ·
Yes, for breaking the head, cams, or valves in. This is just about the same thing I heard, too.

My uncle is ASE certified, owns a shop in Florida, and teaches shop class at a high school. He specializes in Corvettes and performance.

What he told me to do with a fresh head or components is to idle the car at 1500 RPMs for about 30 minutes. Then get it cold and adjust the valves. Then idle the car at 2000 RPMs for an hour. Finally, adjust the valves again and the cam and such should be broken in.

There may be deviation from this because he doesn't really do imports. RPM ranges could be like 1800 and 2500.

btw. Thanks for posting the link. :Rock:
 
#33 ·
· full throttle high torque power useage should be limited and never be used until the engine has been running for at least 15 minutes.
· from 0-500 miles, do not exceed 4000 rpm.
· from 500-1000, do not exceed 6000 rpm.
· over 1000 miles, no restrictions.


its suppose to be 1/2 of redline for the first 500 miles. this is for any motor.. no matter if its a briggs motor or our honda motor.
 
M
#35 ·
CADster said:
· full throttle high torque power useage should be limited and never be used until the engine has been running for at least 15 minutes.
· from 0-500 miles, do not exceed 4000 rpm.
· from 500-1000, do not exceed 6000 rpm.
· over 1000 miles, no restrictions.


its suppose to be 1/2 of redline for the first 500 miles. this is for any motor.. no matter if its a briggs motor or our honda motor.
Click to expand...
honda says 4k, darton says 4k, and every other pro engine builder says 4k for honda engines, including ours.
i'll follow the honda-specific reccomendations over a general universal reccomendation any day of the week. you and i both know hondas are much more capable and tolerant than almost any other manufacturer.

and for the record, my personal reccommendation has always been:
0-500 miles; never exceed 4000 rpms
500-1000 miles; never exceed 5000 rpms
1000-1500 miles or 1000-2000 miles; never exceed 6000 rpms
and do an oil change [in the very least] at the 500 mile mark, 1000 mile mark, and 2000 mile mark, then every 3k increment from then on like normal. which equates to increments of 500, 500, 1000, 3000, between oil changes. doesnt hurt to throw a 2000 mile increment in there though either
 
M
#39 ·
nope, sticking to that wont hurt anything, but it also kinda limits your driving abilities.
im not arguing it, im just saying i, as well as darton thinks its ok to go to 4k. and that guide is not only for b-series or vtec, its stated as honda engines. and theres a lot more honda engines out there other than ours that have the same redline as ours.
 
#40 ·
G
#41 ·
johcamp said:
i want all of the "engine gurus" in this thread to go here and read this:

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=878397

Comments?
Click to expand...
I am a big fan of this method. Typically, I just drive the car how I want from day one.

1. Crank over with no ignition for oil pressure
2. Start and idle for 10minutes
3. Check and adjust anything needed
4. Away we go

I dont post that as my opinion most of the time because most people think the "long" break-in period is better. All I can say is that I have never had a problem with this way. I have also been told by many performance shops in my area that they dont do any xxx miles break-in. Just load up the motor a few times and tune away. I believe in this method and it makes sense to me to do it this way...doesnt mean everyone will.

My grandpa has built engines for the last 20yrs and does the same thing, almost no break-in. I follow suit and have nothing, but good running engines.

Its pretty much an opinion on method. I agree that today's machining and parts are much better designed then 50yrs ago and I think that is what the 500mile rule is for. Plus the only thing you are doing is seating the rings, with the exception of valvetrain. That takes higher cylinder pressures to seat them better and is typically achieved rather quickly i.e. ~20 minutes. All that extra time is really for nothing. If something is incorrectly clearanced it wont just wear in, if it will break in 25miles what makes you think it wont break after 500miles?

Most people are also under the assumption that you have to break-in bearings. The bearings hardly wear at all and there is oil between the journal surfaces and the bearings, so there is no real metal on metal contact.

I personally recommend this method on Honda-Tech, and this method has been used by many around the country. I see more people using the "quick" method today then the 500mile. To be completely honest, this is one of the only sites I see the "long" method recommended on a regular basis.

BTW, my car this spring with the built motor will be put on the dyno and tuned with no break-in. Just ran for 10minutes and then put on the dyno to tune.
 
M
#42 ·
the main reason for the longer break-in period is hot-spots. if there is one tiny little edge that has a bit less clearnace than the rest of that surface, it will see a bit more friction, which causes heat. if the heat builds up enough, it can warp that part, taking out vital engine parts.
a longer gentler break-in in short bursts aloowing for cool-off time in between each driving session will allow these ever so mildly uneven surfaces to wear over time into a more even surface eliminating the hot spot
 
#45 · (Edited)
motoxxxman said:
a longer gentler break-in in short bursts aloowing for cool-off time in between each driving session will allow these ever so mildly uneven surfaces to wear over time into a more even surface eliminating the hot spot
Click to expand...
amen... well said !!!!!!

race engines and what not are not really broken in, they are ran hard from day one.
they also only last a few seasons at the most.


gc8dc95 said:
I personally recommend this method on Honda-Tech, and this method has been used by many around the country. I see more people using the "quick" method today then the 500mile. To be completely honest, this is one of the only sites I see the "long" method recommended on a regular basis.
Click to expand...
and how many engines that are broke in like this run for 250k miles ???

yea.. thats what i thought.
 
M
#51 ·
98vtec said:
earl :Rock:

r.i.p. :cry:
Click to expand...
johcamp said:
i want all of the "engine gurus" in this thread to go here and read this:

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=878397

Comments?
Click to expand...

CADster said:
and how many engines that are broke in like this run for 250k miles ???

yea.. thats what i thought.
Click to expand...



yup, thats how i broke my motor in, still running today, after what? 4 years now??

and guess what.. leak down test show less then 2% leakage.. to this day...

too bad earl isnt around anymore.. he was the man to look up to..
 
Honda Prelude Forum
posts
2.9M
members
64K
Since
2002
A forum community dedicated to Honda Prelude owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about performance, modifications, engine builds, troubleshooting, maintenance, VTEC, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Explore Our Forums
3rd Gen 5th Gen General Prelude Discussions 4th Gen 2nd Gen